Sunday, September 27, 2009

India Daily Says That Indian Space Organization Will Attempt to Force NASA to Admit "Extraterrestrial Presence" on the Moon in Wake of Water Discovery

Interesting little article from a mainstream Indian online newspaper: Indian Space Reserach Oragization's probe finds water in Moon, NASA decides to accept the fact that it knew for decades - next step extraterrestrial presence on moon?


fieryjaguarpaw said...

Ha ha. I love it.

Lance said...

Hya, Valkyrie Ice here.

Just finished reading Dark Mission and I have to say it was a very interesting read. I can't say you've convinced me 100% about NASA's mystical conspiracy, mainly because as an old Atlantologist I've dealt with far to many conspiracy theories to by into any more without overwhelming evidence, but I am old enough to remember most of the controversy over the Face and quite a bit of the chicanery NASA has pulled over it in the news.

Suffice it to say I'm convinced they are covering things up but not 100% on the exact reasons why.

Been noticing several things recently. Mainly an increase in the number of NASA associates willing to hint that maybe life does exist on mars, and even read an article where one admitted it was possible life on Earth came from Mars. I'm looking forward to the next decade, because as the internet continues to grow into a world wide knowledge bank these kinds of secrets are becoming harder and harder to hide.

I've be convinced that Atlantis was a colony from somewhere else because while there is ample evidence that a highly advanced civilization existed in prehistory, and was destroyed, what is conspicuously absent is the traces of large scale resource use (ala industrial age phase that would have been required to progress the significantly high level of tech indicated)

I am curious as to your and Mr Hoagland's take on the Electric Universe theories, as I see some very interesting similarity between that, and the electrogravitic work of T Townsend Brown, as well as the Russian work on torsion field you discussed.

My personal theory is that the previous Civilization was in a phase near what Kurzweil terms the singularity, a highly advanced stage with at least basic nanofacturing abilities, with the ability to alter their bodies at will. The preponderance of anthropomorphic "gods" speaks of a society in which human animal crosses were common, but as these gods were still "human" in thought and action despite their appearance they were obviously human modifications.

I am quite familiar with many of the past history scenarios due to my interest in Atlantis, such as Velikovsky, Stichtin, Von Daniken, Hancock, and others, including such controversial works as Muck's Aryan theories on Atlantis and would be quite interested in discussing such things further.

And maybe, one day I'll be one of those explorers who helps investigate those ruins on the moon and Mars, and even those that I am sure exist in Antarctica as well.

Starborne said...

Woah, I just read the article and I'm impressed. I don't know if anyone has read any of the other articles on that page or not, but they have some information that just about floored me.

Is this a really a legit news site? They have more information than most "alternative news" sites that most of us are always looking at, and they appear to know what they're talking about.

Seriously guys, if you haven't read the article yet, or some of the other articles that are linked down at the end of the very short article.

If this is the real deal, then I'm thinking that maybe, India is the country mentioned by Steven Greer that wants to work with him and his group about bringing about a full disclosure of the ET subject, starting with a controled contact with these groups that Greer seems to be in contact with.

I may be putting forth some major speculation here, but like I said... if this is a true legit news site from India, then the implications are HUGE!!!

Mike, thanks for posting this... it just may be the biggest story yet!

Lance said...

Valkyrie Ice again

I did indeed read the site as well as the other articles involved. I've often found that the news in countries outside the US tend to be far more impartial and responsible as journalists than most american sources, which far too often are little more than spin machines, or sensationalistic junk. The American media can rarely be bothered to actually report the NEWS because all they are concerned with is ratings, which means truth is less important than entertaining distractions.

The sole sciences in America which seem to even remotely be honest anymore are those involving physical experimental research, such as chemistry and biology, as well as computers. Anything which directly deals with physics or space has seemingly descended into a world of delusion and denial.

There is massive evidence of electricalmagnetic forces being the primary forces in space, not gravity, and failure to understand this has lead to such mystical impossibilities as dark matter, dark force, and dark whatever, with no allowance for the work done in plasma physics which can not only predict many of the "mysterious" findings which these dark phantasms are used to try and explain away.

After reading the physics proposed by Hoagland and Bara, I can see where between their work and that of the plasma cosmologists, much that has been "mysterious" could be explained, which is why I am interested in their take on the Electric Universe model. The articles in the Indian paper also seem to support some of the work of T Townsend Brown, who believed the gravity, electricity, and magnetism are the three faces of a single force and inseparable.

I am also a transhumanist. So I think the next few years are going to be what the Chinese meant when they cursed someone to live in interesting times.

Admin said...

I liked this article
Who transported 7 million tons of earth soil to Mars?
India Daily Technology Team
Jun. 7, 2008

NASA is slowly uncovering signs that soil on Mars may contain microbial life. It is just a matter of time that we get to know first extraterrestrial life forms in Mars that can survive harshest of the environments.

Scientists also estimate that close to 7 million tons of earth soil is sitting on Mars. The biggest question is who transported it? The way earth’s soil is distributed in Mars makes an evolutionary biologist nick up again and again.

Who transported such massive amount of earth soil to mars?

There is some theory that earth’s volcanoes billions of years back move these soil. Mars is that close to earth. If Moon did not get it, how can Mars get it?

The answer lies in lost ancient civilizations in the earth that were many times more sophisticated than that of ours. It had an extraterrestrial origin which brought Type III level sophistication in technologies.

Millions of years back the extraterrestrial civilization that reigned the earth created a super highway between earth and Mars through the moon. As earth deteriorated in living conditions, shifting of colonies took place. Eventually when conditions in Mars also deteriorated, they left to other solar systems. They left microbial life forms (their genetically manipulated so call ‘life’) of seed that will blossom into intelligent life one day if and when earth becomes more livable. We are the result of those genetic seeds. What we are finding in Mars is the same genetic seeds that created ‘life’ including us. If and when Mars become livable again, the microbial genetic seeds will eventually allow evolution of intelligent life forms.

T'Zairis said...

I LOVE it!!!!!!

The more probes that other countries launch, the more obvious it becomes that certain elements within the U.S. space program, etc., have been data-trashing and gate-keeping for decades. The idiots who think that by sequestering anomalous findings and 'exotic' technology that they will keep everybody 'sucking the Big Oil tit' cannot keep a lid on the rest of the world-- there are too few of them and too many of the rest of us. We also have 'outside help', if folks catch my drift.

And there's India, looking at the U.S. and NASA, going 'You are not the boss of me...'



Tim said...

The skeptic in me sees a similarity between "India Daily" and "Pravda". I'm going to need more convincing that this is not a sensationalist rag.

marsandro said...

Greetings All,

Truly advanced technology that CAME
from elsewhere was BUILT elsewhere,
or so I should think to be obvious.

Then again, what happened to the physical
evidence of the means by which the Sphinx and
the pyramids were built? Where is all that now?

Earth upheavals explain some of it.

Military satellite photos of late can explain much
more. For instance the "Atlantean continent"
(not to be confused with the CITY of Atlantis)
is now the Atlantic Ocean floor. And lo, there
are great cities all over it. (Can you say, "Bimini
Roads and THEN some?")

Incidentally, the *city* of Atlantis was found
under 300 feet of water on the southeast side
of the island of Cypress quite some years ago.
Robot submersibles got excellent pictures of the
old city wall, exactly as Plato described, and
other features, all of which were published
on the front covers of dive magazines.

I often wonder why people still talk about
"the search for Atlantis" in light of such facts.

I mean, like, DUH....

It's rather like arguing on about the existence
of Aliens after having had tea with them.

(Oops---a TEA party! No WONDER the Government
doesn't like Aliens!!!) ;-))

Just imagine if, for instance, an Indian space
probe got perfectly clear pictures of a motel
on the Moon showing Zetas diving into a
swimming pool on the motel's Club Deck.

Proof of both Aliens on the Moon AND the
presence of water.... :-))

...with chlorine, even.... (LOL)

All under a GLASS DOME, obviously.... (LMAO)

Lunar artifacts would come to include party
favors.... (ROFLMAO)

[At this point, picture The Cat holding his
tummy and kicking his furry feet in the air,
tail flailing, laughing hysterically.]


Hathor -- Reading The Atlantic Monthly Journal


P.S.: Old Zeta saying---

[cue fiddle]

"We'll leave the light on for ya."

<= )


A.F said...

people, i always belived that the final revelation, would come from India or China.

I bet in India, and note this...the indians are way more open in Ufos and ancient Civ, than Americans and Europeans..

Their own national religion is composed with storys LITERALY talking about vimanas, gods from other planets, and nuclear wars !

They grew up with tose facts !

I belive just like the article sas, that the Indian investigators didnt make the revelation yet, because of pressure from the indian republic..who fears broking relations with the USA, and maybe Europe..

But wait and see..

T'Zairis said...

Pravda and India Today are not 'sensationalist rags' like the National Enquirer and the Brit tabloids. They are major news organs for their respective countries. I know this because I work in a library.

The reason they publish UFO-related information is that right now, ironically, Russia and India have a much freer press than does the U.S. or Britain. Pravda and India Today run UFO articles because a) such information is of intense interest to their readership and b) it is not government policy in their countries to cover up and/or belittle the whole UFO issue.

Another factoid of interest that should be considered is that the number one U.S. tabloid-- the National Enquirer-- was started up with seed money from the CIA. What better way to rubbish the real UFO issue than to run fluff articles about it intermixed with crotch-shot photos of Britney Spears without her underwear? Couple that with the carefully positioned idea that bona fide U.S. papers 'don't print articles on UFOs because only the tabloids do that' and you have perfect 'only approved propaganda' press control.

At any rate, I'm still laughing, as the India Today article is yet more evidence that disclosure is coming sooner rather than later. It is entirely possible that the recent and current U.S. leadership will go down in history as a bunch of back-biting, lying and foot-dragging gits rather than as enlightened leaders who ushered in a new and beneficial-to-the-world period of technological advance and ET contact. They've been given every opportunity to be noble, but they keep insisting on being short-sighted and selfish liars, so if India scoops the U.S. with regard to an ET presence on the Moon, it will be, as they say, 'our own damn fault'.



Lance said...

Valkyrie Ice again.

Marsandro, if you are referring to Thera, I am afraid you are mistaken.

The problem lies in taking Plato as more than what it is... Fiction. Like most writers, Plato took elements of various stories to create the "Atlantis" described in the Dialogues. It was a follow up to his "Republic", and contained some elements of fact intertwined with fiction. The Atlantis he wrote about was a strawman "Evil Empire" which his "Model Republic" Athens could overcome. In parts he used legends about the destruction of Thera, in others he drew upon Egyptian legends. But Thera is not “Atlantis”. The remains in Bimini may be Atlantian, but they would not be "Atlantis" as that city was wholly fictional. The "center" of the Atlantian civilization is most likely Antarctica, as the most ancient maps show that continent in an ice free state.

Otto Heinrich Muck theorized that a large asteroid collision with the earth in the region of the Puerto Rican Trench, close to the Mid Atlantic Ridge, would have resulted in the solid crust of the Earth breaking the adhesion with the mantle and moved the crust around the surface of the globe, taking North America out of the Arctic, putting Antarctica into it's current polar position, while causing massive eruptions world wide, as well as submerging enormous areas of the Continental Plateaus. There is substantial evidence listed in his book "The Secret of Atlantis" though as a Nazi, his influence on the Thule society and the "Aryans are Atlantian descendants" may be responsible for some the BS NASA has pulled.

If you believe the stories about a Nazi base in Antarctica uncovering a city under the ice, from which they recovered some technological relics, it simply adds additional evidence to the theories Bara and Hoagland advanced about the Nazi agenda in NASA.

I see it as possible that ancient spaceports may still be in Antarctica. If you suppose that Mars is Humanities homeplanet, then the moon was likely a habitat for beginning the colonization of Earth. It seems likely that Cro Magnon man was the survivor of the Great Disaster. The explosion of the planet to which Mars was a moon (uncertain if this was the original homeworld of man, from which Mars was colonized) destroyed the Martian ecosphere, devastated the fragile moon domes, and could have been the source of the asteroid which shoved Antarctica to the pole, effectively destroying the entire civilization. Many of them fled to Europe and elsewhere, killing off Neanderthal. Some few survivors might have survived in the Antarctic for several thousand years until the encroaching ice finally forced them to flee as well, becoming the wave of "civilizers" spoken of in world wide myths.

I have often wondered if the "junk DNA" in our genetic code is simply nanotechnological instructions for nanomachines which gradually broke down due to lack of maintenance. A nanotechnological civilization could have easily built on the scale of the apparent ruins on the moon and Mars, as well as explain the numerous man/beast "gods" and mythological species. Without a means to maintain such sophisticated technology it is likely simple biology resumed. It is even possible that we are a resulting cross between true "man" and Neanderthal, with our Cro Magnon genes being dominant.

I can see where this knowledge would be something a group seeking world dominance such as the Nazis would want to keep hidden. Most western religions would seek to suppress such knowledge as well, as it would shatter the very mythological foundations upon which they are built. Therefore it is unlikely any Western nation will be willing to unreservedly tell the truth, whereas the Eastern Nations do not share the common myth base which is the root of western civilization.

I would be willing to bet that most of the "Disclosure" will come from pressure by the East to make the West admit the truth.

Aren't these interesting times to live in?

marsandro said...

Yo Lance,

Santorini (aka "Thera") is high and dry. You can
even book a flight there.

It's also not ON Cypress.

*THE CITY* of Atlantis IS UNDER WATER. 300 feet
worth, I could have sworn I said.

ON Cypress (but underwater, offshore).

The pictures are published.

The legend (a la Plato) FITS, any sort of claimed
embellishments notwithstanding.

The whole nine yards was on Nova on PBS back in
the late 1990s or so.

At *no* time did I call the Bimini Roads "Atlantis."

Incidentally, divers visit the Bimini Roads every
summer, and have done so for decades. It's one of
Florida's more popular dive spots.

Just clarifying it for you....


Hathor -- Drumming her fingers on the table...


P.S.: Some quick "his"-story:

(if you can believe what a cat says)

Around 80,000 years ago were what I call "The
Nephilim Wars." (Authority for the date: Tom
Valone's access of a still-working alien computer
in a petrified ruin of a ship that had been in
a battle with an enemy alien bunker, the latter
of which I have visited personally. The computer contained a record of the battle, and had kept
track of time over the millinea.)

Atlantea and Lemuria were at war. On the
Atlantean side were the Lyrans (or what we
know today as Nordics). On the Lemurian side
were the Draco (known today as the Reptoids).

The Sword of Nemesis (a Zetan capital warship) was
locked in battle with a Draco warship near Earth.
The Draco fired on the Sword of Nemesis with what
we might call a "neutron beam" type of weapon,
seriously scoring the hull. The beam swept back
and forth, but nothing happened.

The Draco adjusted their aim and continued firing,
sweeping the beam back and forth until there was
an explosion abord the Zetan warship.

The Zetan dreadnought returned fire with their
best weapon, something we might liken to what
Trekkers would call "transphasic photon torpedoes."
(The actual weapon can be seen in action in a
declassified Soviet Union UFO interception video
in which two MiG fighters are destroyed, and the
pilots killed, with cameras rolling.)

The Draco exploded like a pipe bomb, sending
the obsydium-like debris of its hull flying away
into a permanent Earth-crossing orbit...

...producing what today are known as "The
Perseid meteors"....

The Sword of Nemesis, badly damaged but still
functional, set down safely in Allied territory,
a relatively sparsely settled region of northern

...known today as southern Greenland.

The Sword of Nemesis is visible on Google Maps
as that big orange thing lying in the ice about
240 miles east northeast of Jacob's Harbor.

You can see the scoring on the hull left by the
Draco beam weapon, and the hole produced by
the on-board explosion when the weapon found
its target.

The black strip to the south is reported by my
contacts to be an array of nuclear-tipped missles
ready to blow the Sword of Nemesis to bits if it
tries to take off...

...being as in the Spring of 2007, it suddenly
melted the snow and ice, exposing itself, as if
preparing to lift off.

It seems the A/I is alive and well....

According to people whom I shall decline to
identify in this venue, in the Spring of 2008, the
Alpha Team of the UFO Recovery Group (UFORG)
were dispatched to try to get control of the
Sword of Nemesis.

Reportedly, they went in guns blazing, only to be
met by the security systems....

Their last radio message indicated that they
were engaged in a heavy firefight with some
sort of alien machines, and needed help....

They were never heard from again.

No backup team was ever sent.

The missles are on 24-hour hot standby....


P.P.S.: Now---

do I have a future as a science fiction writer,
or what?


P.P.P.S.: I'm amenable to birthday geetings,
if anyone cares to say it.... ;-)


T'Zairis said...


Is your Tom Valone the same Dr. Tom Valone who used to work for the U.S. Patent Office and who is also a Disclosure project witness? And of course I have to ask you what you saw in the bunker...

Oh, and Happy Birthday!



SunKing said...

That was an interesting article...and I agree with the posterwho said their culture is more attuned to such reports.

Hi T'Zemt....long time! Missed your insights from the old Captain's Blog. Regards!

marsandro said...

Hi T'Zairis,

I guess that's him. I'd say
probably so. (I'm assuming the
name is not coincidental.)

We went to see this bunker that had been
blasted to rubble out in the California desert.

You could also see the wreckage of the rod
ship (a Zeta design) in the mountain saddle
on the opposite side of the valley.

We did not enter the bunker (and I didn't see
where you could do that safely anyway), but
we walked all over the top of it.

The roof and walls were made of some sort of
obsydium-like material that was impervious to
anything we could use to try even to scratch it.
It blunted three hack saws, and broke one of them.

Nary a scratch on the stuff....

Tom had a glass cutter. It couldn't even make a
mark on it.

The material felt like plastic, and yet was
stronger than anything known to Man. It
wouldn't burn, melt, cut, scratch or break.

Funny thing is, the material appeared to have been
worked with a trowel, and moreover in a pattern
familiar to me from my days doing labor jobs with
construction firms. I forget the name of the
pattern, but it's commonly used for plaster on
drywall, especially in "Mexican" restaurants like
El Chico's or Posado's.

And something had blown the bunker apart.

Tom had read the computer records from the ship,
and it told the account of the firefight between
the ship and the bunker...which took place some
80,000 years ago.

That's the period I call "The Nephilim Wars,"
were Atlantea (or Atlantia) and Lemuria were
fighting it out for control of the Earth.

And thank you for the birthday salutation! :-))


Hathor -- Lighting the candles...all 57 of them


Starborne said...

Well, Happy Birthday Marsandro!

That truely is an Uber-provocative story you have concerning the mammoth "ship" over there in Greenland. Speculation is fun especially when you may be partly correct. ;) lol

T'Zairis said...


Here is the url for the PESwiki entry for Dr. Tom Valone. It has a pic along with his CV, so you should be able to tell if Dr. Tom Valone and your Tom Valone are one and the same person:

I am also slightly confused about something-- which ship did Tom get the computer stuff from? The one in Greenland, or the wrecked one near the bunker? Also, how was he able to get the info? I'm assuming that the average person on the street isn't allowed near the wrecked bunker and ship in the CA desert, and if the Greenland machine's AI is still defending the ship, how would anyone get close enough to access computer data? I'm not disputing your info/story at all, I'm just a bit muddled about exactly where the computer info came from.

SunKing: Good to see you, too!! It's nice to see familiar e-faces gathering round, and yeah, I also kinda missed everyone's interesting input at the old Captain's Blog. I had a great time digging through stuff on Jack Parsons and JPL, and I was just ready to make a couple of observations about certain similarities between George Hale's 'little elf' visitations (that resulted in the building of the Palomar telescope) and Tesla's trance-like dream-states in which he frequently grokked his inventions all in one go, but then everything tapered off.

Anyway, glad to see you're back...



Lance said...

Valkyrie, please, Marsandro, Lance is simply the name on my Driver's license and has little to do with me. It's used simply for the necessity to have an email address I can use for professional correspondence.

And you mistook me, I said IF you are referring to Thera. And if they did find a city near Cyprus that matches Plato's description, it simply illustrates my point about him combining legends.

The Minoan Civilization had been destroyed by the Thera eruption almost 900 years prior to Plato, so it's legends and mysteries would have been around for Plato to use. However, as I said he mixed various information sources to create the Atlantis of his Dialogues so it was a wholly fictional city.

Atlantian (Atlantean) has become a broader term for the overall evidence for a highly technological civilization prior to ours.

Being of a highly scientific mindset, I tend to dismiss "psychic" sources of information unless backed by physical evidence, since "psychic" info is too easily faked. That being said, there is ample evidence for the existence of psychic phenomena.

UFOology is a subject I have also tended to view skeptically. While I believe the likelihood of Alien Observers is High, it is again a field in which too much "noise" is present to definitively say one way or another what the truth is as of yet. I am hoping that Disclosure will occur soon and allow a lot of that "noise" to be eliminated. Like psychic phenomena, too much of the "evidence" tends to be too easily faked.

That's why I have tended to stick to Atlantology and verifiable evidence, such as the water erosion on the Sphinx, etc. Archeological anomalies abound and are not so easily faked as videotapes or psychic readings, which is why I am so fascinated by Hoagland and Bara's work. It ties directly into my lifelong obsession with the Precursors.

A.F said...

I bet those NASA and Secret Gov. folks cant fake MY PHOTOS


or maybe...the´re already faked..:/

marsandro said...

Hi T'Zairis,

Yep, looks like him, except
younger in that photo.

Same guy, apparently.

And it was the desert ship where he managed to
access the computer. He found the wreck through
a local indian shaman who knew of it, and of
the bunker. That was in 2001.

The ship in the desert is scarcely a lifeboat
compared to that monster in Greenland. The
desert wreckage is perhaps a couple of thousand
feet long at best (I'm guessing), and is broken
into pieces. Moreover, it's petrified. And yet,
the computer (and some other systems) still work.

Tom was approached by some Govt MIB about his
work with these artifacts, and declined their
"offer." It came down to a confrontation, with
the suggestion of a "firepower demo" if need be.

The ship in Greenland is roughly 12.5 miles wide
by 49.5 miles long (exposed) with about another
20 miles still under the ice. The whole thing
was under the ice until January of 2007, when
*FIRE* came from beneath the ice and melted the
whole nine yards, exposing the ship for the
first time in modern history.

Interestingly, all of the civilian satellite services
have it airbrushed out in their imagery.

How can one tell? There's NO TERRAIN in their
images...totally featureless....

The LANDSAT images (used by Google) have the
terrain features intact.

Only the military stuff is blacked out.

In this case, racks of nuclear-tipped interceptors
installed in what I assume was terrified haste.

The Pentagon brass must have freaked out when
this thing appeared.

Only the UFORG A-Team has ever been near the
Sword of Nemesis. Word is, all of them perished.

Anyway, yes, that's Tom, and it was the ship
in the desert where he read the files. And
he did it by sticking his fingers in some holes
he found in a "rock" (three holes each side),
and closing his eyes. Then, a "Gray" appeared
in his Mind's Eye, and he was able to ask it
questions, and get answers: text, images, the
works. Just like our machines, except in your
head. Neat. Weird, too.

It also gave him some system control access.

(Certain of the Grays and the Blue Zetas are
either related, or at least allied.)

You can reach these sites by Jeep...we did.... :-)


Thank you for the salutation! And you bet
this stuff is fascinating! I'd like to try
reaching the Sword of Nemesis to try to talk
to the A/I, which should be easy enough to do
through the (should be) universal psychotronic
interface the ship's systems use.

(Touch a panel, and think, "I need a door." And
one appears!) have to get access first...and
that means reaching a computer station without
tripping the security systems. Probably easy
enough if you don't go in with a gun in your
hands...blasting everything that moves....


Hathor -- Posing in ski boots and winking


P.S.: I was cleared to "Tango" (routinely called
"Above Top Secret") at my Security Interview
in Basic Training, but I actually carried only a
Secret Clearance day to day in the field for my
particular AFSC.

My father, however, was a "Tango" clearance
man, all the way up....


marsandro said...


I once thought that the tales of Atlantea and
Lemuria were a load of bull. Now, thanks to
ocean-piercing satellite technology, I know

Then, there's all the undersea photo imagery
of the Bimini Roads, Atlantis(?), and the
great cities of the Atlantic floor.

And, I've stood toe-to-toe with a Blue Zeta....

It kind of changes your world view once that

And I live by the maxim, "The first duty of
Science is OBSERVATION."

(This is because of that little witticism about
how "whenever the theory and observations don't
agree, the observations must be disposed of.") :-))

And I grew up with certain "inside knowledge"
because of who my father was in the Air Force...

...former NCOIC for the SAC Inspector General,
whom I met (at age 3-1/2) at our house in
June 1956, the day my father retired from
active duty.

Yes, I knew General John Parks, right hand of
General Curtis E. "Nuke" LeMay, founder of the
Strategic Air Command....


Hathor -- Imagine her as a WAF....


T'Zairis said...


Thanks so much for the clarification! Mostly what I've heard Dr. Valone talk about (via the Disclosure Project) is zero-point energy systems.

I am not at all surprised about the consciousness technology (i.e., stick your fingers in a rock and see a Zeta in your head), as my own experiences with meditation and crop formations are in complete agreement with what you're talking about. They use consciousness the same way we use telephones.

Based on what I know through my own experiences, I would guess the following things about the Greenland ship-being:

1) It is defending itself against anyone who attempts to board it for the purposes of war/military gain. The ship would know what people's ulterior motives and hidden strategies were/are, because that is part of what is grokked in *any* routine consciousness interface.

2) The only way I think the ship will allow access to anyone would be if they were there for honestly peaceful purposes, and there would have to be no hidden agendas, because the ship would be able to detect any sort of duplicity. It would also be a very good idea for anyone approaching the ship to seek to actively comfort it/befriend it.

There was a Disclosure Project witness who worked for Bell Labs who was given a small, disc-shaped communications device to back-engineer. He got the paradigm-shock of his life when the disc telepathically asked him to please destroy it, as the people who were seeking to use its technology were doing so for harmful purposes. The engineer was so rattled that he locked the device in a filing cabinet, took a week off work and went on a major alcohol-consumption-fest, during which time he wondered if he should go see a psychiatrist. He finally came back to work, and decided to do as the device had asked-- he hooked it up to multiple batteries and ran enough voltage through it to completely fry the device. Just before the device died, it said 'Thank you' to him. My point here is that this is not human-style 'dead' technology we're talking about. The Skypeople's ships are living, sentient beings.

3) The nuclear missiles positioned near the Greenland ship are absolutely no deterrent to the craft taking off any time it feels like it or it is asked to. It will simply deactivate the missiles in the same way that the UFO at Malmstrom AFB deactivated the nukes there as they sat in their silos.

4) I think the ship has been exposed (or has exposed itself) now because we are rapidly approaching the point where the Skypeople are going to disclose themselves. They've tried seeding ideas for technology development into human heads (a la Tesla's trances) since the early 1900's, and at every turn, greed and small-mindedness have thwarted their gifts. The situation is now one of having to 'catch us up all in one go', as there is a development timetable that Gaia herself must meet, and the sentient planet is not going to be told she has to wait for her own upgrade just because a few retarded monkey-boys want to continue to brutalize their fellows.

I have to say I would dearly love to see that bunker/wreck first-hand... Sekhmet says, 'Let's all go on a field-trip!'



Lance said...


I would be quite interested in seeing some of those photos Marsandro. I've often wondered whether Lemuria was simply a derivative of the Atlantian mythos, since it seems to be a fairly recent addition to the meme. I can't remember atm if it was Blatavasky or Cayce who talked about it first.

Please don't get me wrong, I am someone who is always willing to accept new data, but I do require a slightly higher level of "proof" than just someone's stories, since as a writer myself I am quite capable of creating an entire mythology with logical self consistency that is nonetheless complete fiction.

That's why I find the Disclosure Project somewhat more believable than a random "UFO" tale. It's not an isolated case, it is many different people with positions in which they could have easily had access to the information that they talk about. Any one of the could be dismissed by themselves, but when combined they make for a much stronger case.

Take for example a story I have heard about the existence of "true" Vampires. 99% of the stories I have heard are absolute garbage, teen fantasies based on Whitewolf and Anne Rice.

But along with that crap I have heard from certain people I trust quite highly that they have had encounters with vampires of the traditional kind, and the details of these stories are too precise and identical between them for me to dismiss them as simple fantasy. They are people who to the best of my knowledge, do not even know each other, did not share any sort of history together, and had no reason to lie, in several cases they didn't even want to believe themselves, but still shared nearly identical stories. And these were not details I could find in the usual vampire websites online.

In much the same way, there are some stories about UFO's I find believable, and some which seem just made up tales based on popularly available information on the net or in the popular literature.

Which is why I am always interested in putting together the pieces and sorting out the real from the hype. I'm a skeptic, but one who is unwilling to ever close the book on an unanswered question just because others may view it as "crackpot."

Valkyrie Ice said...

Val again

Sorry for the double post but had a few more thoughts.

I suppose to be honest about the UFO issue I should simply say this.

I'm a transhumanist, a strong advocate of the Singularity, and if my profile pic ever shows up you'll see my preferred physical form. I strongly believe that no matter what the "truth" is, we're going to discover it within the next twenty years or so, either through the internet's inherent ability to destroy secrets, which will result in a gradual realization of and acceptance of that "truth" whatever it is, or through the intervention of "higher powers" be they gods/aliens/dimensional beings/Artificial Intelligences/whatever." Regardless of which it is, the current system is going to undergo radical and massive change.

I would love if Aliens would reveal themselves and enable this transition more rapidly, because then I could be sure we will survive this transition with the fewest number of lives lost. But I fear that such an event is merely wishful thinking. I hope for it, but I do not count on it.

Regardless I am not a catastrophist, I don't believe in doomsday scenarios. I believe we will indeed survive regardless, but I would prefer that survival involve the fewest number of deaths to occur before we remove the possibility of death from human existence altogether.

As for the rest of your story, providing that aliens do exist, not only would I love to meet one to simply thank them for helping humanity survive, but to ask them to be allowed to learn the true history of our world and our species.

And to maybe finally get an answer to the one question which has driven me to that quest for the truth all my life, the question that lies behind my Avatar...

Who, or what, am I?

SunKing said...

Thanks for remembering.

And I well remember your research re: Parsons and JPL and was most anxious to hear the results..those were some exciting days on the blog.

I had tried to contact you to invite you to follow the remnants of 'the Crewe' to the Drydock blog and then to FSHOD, but it was hard to do since I had no email addy for you. Several of us were disappointed, your insight was missed.

Would still like to hear the results of your work.

Peace to you!

T'Zairis said...


If anybody else from the old Crew is still hanging around anywhere, just let me know where, and I'll pop on over. I have a Blogger blog called 'The Pink Lodge', so you can reach me through the Comments feature there. I also have a page on Facebook under the moniker 'Athena Meteor' (I play a couple of online games there with my library coworkers), so folks can friend-request me and then message me that way, if they prefer.

The gist of the research I was doing is that-- when coupled with what I've garnered from listening to Disclosure witness accounts, etc.-- I have been led to the conclusion that humanity has been the recipient of 'routine consciousness-seeding' by the Skypeople for a heck of a long time. I won't go into all the details here-- don't want to clog things-- but I think Tesla got thought-downloaded because his consciousness was at the correct (longitudinal EMF) frequency, while Hale 'got an elf' as he suffered from depression for most of his life. The Skypeople still wanted to talk to him about how to build Palomar, etc., so they essentially sent a physical rep because it would be less problematic given Hale's 'bad modulator'. I'll go into more detail about this, if you want, but I'll do it over at my own blog.



Valkyrie Ice said...

Hummm. Just ran across this pic and was rather curious as to your take on it Mr. Bara

Ran across it on the Marsanomaly site, and went to MSSS to double check it.

I quite agree with the marsanomoly site that in the lower right hand side of the picture there appears to be a giant human head, seen from about the nose up as if it was a massive statue buried in the ground. There also appears to be traces of the lower jaw and a possible mouth. As an artist, I am amazed by the nearly exact proportions on this "artifact" and I would suspect tampering but it appears in picture after picture after picture all on the MSSS site.

Have you seen this pic, and is there a new photo of it? is this a real item or possibly Malin playing tricks again?

Mike Bara said...

Mmm, I kinda see what you're talking about, but it's just a context map and fairly low resolution. Not really sure about this one.

Don't forget this post either:

marsandro said...


You can google some pictures of
the Bimini Roads under "images"
of course.

But it seems the really good stuff is not on
the web (???!!!).

The best Bimini Roads pictures I have ever seen
included great statues done in the classical
Greek style, with columns, paved roadways, and
other goodies. These were in relative shallows
somewhere near Miami, and appeared on the front
cover of some dive magazine or other (sorry,
I don't recall the name; it was too many years

YouTube has some of the underwater cities in
videos about Google anomalies. Most of the
ones they show, however, are in mountain lakes
in South America, although I seem to recall
one somewhere near Greenland (ah, that place
again!), between there and Iceland (that is, best
I can recall).

That latter find likely is an old Atlantean city.

Whatever it is, it's the size of New York....

In addition, this stuff is found near Egypt,
and all over the Mediterranean. In fact, such
underwater ruins can be found all over the

It tends to lend credence to the biblical account
of the Noation Deluge (which is something of a
misnomer, considering that rain was only one
component of the event).

An interesting point about the Bimini Roads is
their scale---they're mostly laid stones, but the
stones are *HUGE*....

More pyramid-builder type stuff....

Good info abounds.... :-)


Hathor -- Running the submersible...


P.S.: You might enjoy reading Michael Credo's book,
"Forbidden Archaeology."

I'll bet T'Zairis can get you the ISBN in a jiffy....


marsandro said...

Hi T'Zairis,

Good points about the Greenland
vessel, and a fascinating story
from inside the tech establishment.

One thing, though...:

The ship appears to have been in battle, and is
evidently a warship. There are even SOHO pictures
of identical vessels *in battle* with what some
contactee reports would identify as Draco war

The good news is, the Dracos lost....

I can fish up the URL for you, as I checked on it
recently, and the pictures are still there....

Anyway, I have to wonder what reaction one
would get from a *warship*...I mean, would it
really say something like, "Hey, you want to
make war on your fellows, and, well, I may be a
warship,but I'm not fighting for YOU...."

Would it really respond with the Alien equivalent
of "Hell no, I won't go?"

It's response to the UFORG guys was natural; they
went in guns blazing. Duh. this point, we have to speculate on
things like loyalty issues...not to mention the
problem of...:

It's been "alone" for over 80,000 years, and what
if it was simply abandoned? Were there any final
orders? What were they? Would the A/I still carry
them out? Or even remember them?

Or even care? Does it/can it "care"???

I'm thinking about the "DarkStar" scenario...

"In the beginning there was ME...and all was




Personally, I'd be more afraid of having something
like THAT happen.... :-\

Anyway, your insights are certainly worth due

And speaking of field trips... :-))

Good thing I bought a new parka!


Hathor -- Hot babe in winter wear...


P.S.: The bunker and the ship are in a desert
parkland area somewhere west (I think) of the
Integratron. At least, I'm fairly sure it was a
location west of there.

I kept thinking it was onward to the east, but
the "K" Lane (Kay? Katy?) is to the west of
there, on Google Maps.

The bunker is on the west side of the valley,
and the ship lies in a mountain saddle directly
to the east of the bunker, easily visible from
the bunker's foothill location.

It's about a 500 yard trek from the valley floor
up the rocks to the bunker. And the roads there
are nothing but sand.

About a mile north of the bunker location is a
well known (???) rock formation consisting of a
VERY large boulder that has been sheared smooth
on its south(?) side. You go more or less directly
south from there to find the bunker.

Caution: *Satanists* frequent the area at night,
and there have been a number of murders there.


T'Zairis said...

Here's ISBN #, etc., info for 'Forbidden Archaeology' by Michael Cremo:

Hardcover: 914 pages
Publisher: Bhaktivedanta Book Publishing; 2nd edition (January 1998)
Language: English
ISBN-10: 0892132949
ISBN-13: 978-0892132942

It's available both new and used on Amazon.


Laughed my head off when you said that the bunker/wreckage stuff is rather near the Integratron-- Why am I *not* surprised??? Joshua Tree National Park (where the Integratron is) is also where Dr. Greer and the CSETI/Disclosure folks like to do one of their 'call in UFOs' workshops each year. Supposedly, they've seen craft in non-physical, energy-mode go straight into the desert floor there.

I'll also go out on a bit of a limb here and say that I think the war story (in the Skyperson computer) is just that-- a story. It's there to scare/intimidate military-minded ape-children in order to keep them away from active technology and bases right here on planet. My guess would be that the Greenland ship isn't really damaged, nor is it a warship. I also don't for one minute think it's the only 60-mile-long ship currently (half-) hidden on Terra-Gaia, either.

I also find it amusing that some power-loving human beings think they are so darned clever when they play 'good cop/bad cop' with their fellows because they want to pressure others into certain courses of action, and yet they never seem to understand that the Skypeople are doing the same to them (and have for milennia), nor do they really understand how much more psychologically sophisticated the Skypeople are. The phrase 'massively outclassed' springs inexorably to mind...



marsandro said...

Hi T'Zairis,

Firstly, I see I misspelled
"Cremo"...duh...(* sheepish
cat face *)....

Fascinating stuff going on out at the Joshua
Tree parkland. I had heard of something being
done along those lines around there, but I had
no details.

The Greenland ship remained under the ice for
millenia, as far as Man knows. It had been
classified as a "gravitational anomaly" by a USGS
client survey back around 1965 or so. The late
Frank Edwards mentioned it in one of his last
two books (on UFOs).

Not damaged? So it's faking the hole? Well, it
certainly could, couldn't it....

I've watched a YouTube video of one of these
things doing what I call "the snake dance" over
a French city in broad daylight, in plain view
of the populace, bending and morphing at random.
After *that* display of technological superiority,
I believe there is nothing they can't do.

As for the "battle site," all I can say is that
the bunker was indeed blasted to rubble. And
the ship appears to have crashed. But...your
points remain....

I'd sure like to visit the Greenland site....

Talk about *cold*, though....


Hathor -- Booking reservations in Jacob's Harbor


Valkyrie Ice said...


That's long been my argument T'zaris.

One of the biggest problems I have with Sitchen is that he proposes an unbelievable technological level for his space faring beings. Any race advanced enough to survive on a planet travelling through deep space will have much better technology than chemical thrust rockets. Nor will the time frames of hundreds even thousands of years with no advances being made by that culture make anyone who is even the remotest bit familiar with the concept of exponential change see his Annunki as anything other than bad scifi.

Any civilization capable of space travel has already overcome the problems we've faced as a species, and has no need to access our planet for any "need" that could not be obtained easily from the uninhabited planets, and asteroids in our system. Our combined military might would be an ant's bite to them. "food" would be much easier and safer to reproduce via cloned tissue. Our natural resources would be dwarfed by the abundance of the asteroids and the outer giants. An advanced culture that was not benevolent in the extreme would have no need to deal with us, any conqueror could have wiped us out a million times by now.

Therefore, logically, the sole reason to visit is to either merely observe, or to aid us in surviving as a race while we make the transition from our primitive roots to a space faring future. Telling us what needs to be said to get us to that point is all too necessary. If they are too benevolent, we'll try to dominate them, if they are too nasty, we won't work with them. Playing good cop bad cop would allow them to guide all sides of human nature, and use both good and bad to help us develop along the least dangerous of many dangerous pathways.

Also, since I believe we were on the verge of becoming a part of this star spanning culture already, if not having arrived here from a separate star originally, several thousand years ago, I see every possibility that some of those "observers" are as "human" as we will be once we've unlocked our true potential.

I've known my entire life that I would not always look the way I do presently in everyday reality. That the future of humanity would be one in which we would be accustomed to a vast diversity of species, humanity just one of an infinite number of intelligences.

I know it's coming. Exactly how or when is the question.

Anyway, if you are curious about some of my views, my blog has the story.

T'Zairis said...

Valkyrie Ice--

Amen!!! The whole 'Sumerian aliens must mine gold on Earth with wee monkey-slaves' concept has always made me laugh! The basic technology that Sitchen predicates just screams '20th Century Earth Mindset', not to mention the fact that experiencer accounts from Clifford Stone to Native American elders to people like Lisette Larkins completely invalidate it. Come to think of it, so does that 60-mile-long ship in Greenland, the inventions of Nicola Tesla and T. Townsend Brown, and all that back-engineered stuff sitting around sequestered in Black projects.

Plus, consciousness-based technology is deeply strange when seen from a strictly present-day Earth-science point of view. Most people think that Skyperson telepathy is just 'a voice in your head', but it's way more than that-- it is a full-on shared merging of the totality of both beings' life experiences. It's an instantaneous knowing of everything, including where all the bodies are buried, who routinely cheats on who, etc. In a society that is based on standard use of consciousness technology, all lying and/or dissembling is rendered impossible by shared Mind. Seeing as most humans can't get through the day without telling at least a few 'socially acceptable' lies, I think there is a major paradigm-jolt in the offing.

I am also in agreement with the 'no need of Earth resources' idea. Seeing as how they can design bodies for themselves which do not need to eat food (and that they make the raw materials for said bodies-- including the DNA-- from 'scratch'), the idea that they need humanity as a food- or gene-source of any kind is utterly laughable.


I'm going with the non-warship idea because of a) what consciousness-based technology implies for the waging of warfare (you'll always know all of the other guy's plans in advance, so no one can surprise anyone else), and b) Native American elders have strong tribal traditions/stories about living inside 'big cylinders' to escape catastrophic changes on Earth's surface. In the Hopi story, they sheltered 'in the underground cylindrical homes of the Ant-people' (and how many times have we heard modern experiencers talk about Greys and certain other Skypeople being insectlike?). This is the reason that Hopi kivas are a) round, and b) are underground. Going into and out of them via ladder reenacts their sacred emergence into the Fifth World.

I also think the Skypeople are past masters at disguising things to look like burnt-out junk. Earth's Moon is a major case in point.



marsandro said...

Hi T'Zairis,

I can assume only that the Draco
must be primitive holdouts, if I
am to go with your position.

And there's nothing wrong with it, certainly.
You may well have it right. It definitely seems
well considered.

I have always wondered what such technologically
advanced peoples would want with us *at all*,
hence I agree completely with you and Val on that
point re slaves, food, etc.

Of course, I keep in mind a certain New Twilight
Zone episode entitled, "A Small Talent For War."
That one still bugs me a bit....

Whichever way, we seem to live in what I can only
describe as an active construction zone.

And to think that NASA has to be dragged kicking
and screaming into the light of reality over water
on the Moon, leave alone the very idea that
*somebody's home* up there.

And as to disguising things to look like junk,
I was more than a little curious how in the world
a *petrified* piece of equipment could still work,
especially after some 80,000 years in the desert
sun on a mountain top.

Your position is intriguing, even if I were to
approach it with skepticism...which for the
most part, I don't.


Hathor -- Nodding agreement...


Tarius said...

Marsandro, I am interested in seeing this bunker/ship combo in google earth, can you give its location more precisely?

T'Zairis said...


I don't think the so-called Draco are any kind of hold-out, primitive or otherwise. I think it very possible that they are tasked with playing the 'bad cop' role when needed. There are certain aggressive humans that only understand an adversarial paradigm, and they only respect superior force/strength. Nothing else even registers as worthy of their notice. Their will towards active aggression needs to be kept occupied while those humans who have actually moved past that way of looking at things are helped up several rungs and given a chance for a much healthier lifestyle.

This presupposes, of course, that the Draco are actually a bona fide alien race and not some MILAB clone-concoction, created to push the 'evil alien' agenda that Von Braun warned Carol Rosin about. The Disclosure witnesses basically agree across the board that all life 'out there' is ethical-- the one thing one cannot have if one wants to be accepted within the community of star-faring civilizations is a warfare ethos. There are also a number of Disclosure witnesses who have a lot to say about MILAB-hoaxed aliens, which are designed for use in false abductions-- done to scare and terrify the abductees and to promote the evil-alien-meme that will be flogged to the public when 'the Russians', 'rogue nations' and 'killer asteroids' have no more traction to keep a permanent war economy going.

As for the petrified machinery, the Skypeople build with some really unique materials. I am thinking here of the tetrahedral ship seen during the Bentwaters encounter-- its surface looked like black pitted glass or obsidian, which isn't what we usually think of as a material for interstellar craft, but then again, our technology is hellaciously primitive and limited in scope, as is our interstellar travel expertise. What I'm saying is that the technology is so exotic (to us) that we don't even know what's possible with what materials. It's that whole CARET/Isaac thing going on, where the glyphs make the substrate they are written on into a sort of 'instant' computer-matrix, despite the CARET parts also being used as a part of a working mechanism.



marsandro said...

Hi Tarius,

Hmmm...I've been perusing the pages, and...

Sure enough, IT IS near the Integratron, and to
the east.

You take Belfield Boulevard from Linn Road up to
Giant Rock Road, and eventually arrive at Giant
Rock. The bunker and ship are somewhere south
of there, a mile or two south via Giant Rock Road
to some turnoff or other. (I remember only that
you go left, and then right, and around some
rocky hills. Then you park, and climb uphill over
rocks and sand for a hundred yards or so.)

Hmmm...that *might* be the bunker I see off the
end portion of Lorraine Avenue, in that section
of hills bordered by 29 Palms McAg Road on the
south side. There's this thing that looks a bit like
a grand piano, in that northeast notch...I think
that's it. It's right at the top of that sandy uphill
trail from the road.

But that would mean the ship lay to the north...
which would mean my directions were all screwed
up when I was there. I thought I was looking to
the east.


I see something that looks roughly like a cylinder
type ship "in rock form," and it's in a saddle in the
mountains to the north, but it isn't nearly big
enough. I'm not sure if that's it, or if I'm still
looking in the wrong spot.

I know it's there somewhere, but I'd either have
to have Tom take me there again, or show me on
the computer map where it is.

Maybe I just don't recognize it from the air....

Anyway, that's the general area---around the
vicinity of 29 Palms, somewhere to the east of
the Integratron.

Locating Giant Rock clenched it. That's definitely
the area. (We visited Giant Rock before going to
the bunker.)


Hathor -- Scanning the map...


P.S.: I was surprised how clearly I could see
Giant Rock. However, I would point out that
it is *indeed* a *giant* rock. That thing is a
lot bigger than it looks.


marsandro said...

Hi T'Zairis,

Now I'm getting confused... :-\

So what's with all the in-space drama via the
SOHO satellite, with all those nice pictures of
giant cylinder ships blasting the lizard stuffings
out of giant black "Draco warships?" (So identified
from contactee accounts.)

All this is what? High Budget Alien Theatre??? To
impress the Department of Defense???

Or have we been..."photoshopped?" By NASA, no less?

(And while we're at it, am I now to believe that
NASA faked a picture of a Rodabear standing
upright, looking directly at a Mars rover? Formerly
on YouTube....)

Color me bumfuzzled....


Hathor -- Poring over the gameboard...


P.S.: Your comments re MILAB resonate with me,
in any event. The average Draco is reported to
resemble a Kimodo Dragon with a vestigial tail,
walking upright, and having an attitude consistent
with a giant lizard that *already* sees us as food,
or, given the intelligence, as slaves.

And considering what I saw on the front cover of
Popular Science more than thirty years ago, I can
easily picture the DoD doing a little DNA-mod on a
Kimodo Dragon, producing a "Draco," if that's what
they needed.


Valkyrie Ice said...

I wouldn't put it past the military to special effect a few space battles to push for space based weapons.

I don't now if you are familiar with a transhumanist term called uploading, but it is basically the concept that eventually any biological based intelligence would achieve a level of technology capable of transferring the brain into a computer based medium, thereby enabling unlimited mental enhancement and operational speeds at computer rates.

Given that space travel requires that level of development, I could even see where the "species" that exist are only little more than temporary physical bodies for a computerized "entity" and as such would be little more than ants are to the overall colony organism.

Which would make the loss of a few "crash victims" about as meaningful as us losing skin cells.

As for Draco's "playing" the bad guys, think about it for a second. Humanity has an instinctive fear of reptiles. What better "villain" than one?

Whenever I hear about "villainous aliens" or see them in the movies, I always find they are cardboard characters with cartoon motives. "rob our planet blind of resources" when the rest of the solar system contains thousands of times more for free. To enslave man, even though they are sophisticated enough to have robots to do all labor. To conqueror us is probably the biggest joke of all.

Think about it seriously. If Marsandro is correct about the battles, name one single earth made weapon which has a chance of even scratching the hull of a SCOUTSHIP, let alone a 60 mile long starship. Even if you take into account possible reverse engineering of some weapons found on wrecks, it would be like a flea trying to keep the dog from scratching if our military tried to stop a serious invasion.

So by simple logic, if aliens exist, are capable of startravel and can build 60 mile long ships, they would be as overwhelming as the Conquistadors were to the Inca.

As we are not currently living as alien prisoners or slaves, we are therefore not a target for conquest. Therefore, stories of hostile aliens are either "bad cop" actors working to keep the darker side of human nature from becoming too destructive, or they are a manufactured "threat" in a false flag operation.

The same holds true for most "alien slave driver" stories. If they wanted to enslave us, we would have been long ago.

We are on the verge of developing technologies to enable us to reshape our bodies to our desires. We're about to be able to change sex and skin tones as easily as we don a shirt. Given what we are capable of, I can not even imagine what a culture THOUSANDS of years older is capable of, but it makes everything thing we know likely little better than a stone age tribe against a division of mechanized infantry.

T'Zairis said...

Valkyrie Ice--

Totally with you on 'changing physicality like a shirt' (or, as the Native American tribal elders refer to it, 'dropping-- or putting on-- the Robe'). Lisette Larkins talks about this very thing with regard to her own experiences with the small Greys. While on board their ship(s), she saw small Grey bodies in what looked like transparent cabinets. When she asked the Greys about the bodies, they explained to her that just as they are involved with teaching humans, so too do they have their own teachers. Many of the Greys' teachers do not routinely wear a physical body, but sometimes there are occasions when they need a temporary one, so the Greys provide 'extras' as a courtesy to these dis-corporeal Beings. They come, enter and animate the body for as long as they need it. When they depart, the body goes back in the drawer, ready for the next Being who may drop by.

Add to this what Phillip Corso said in his Roswell book about the recovered small Beings from the Roswell crash having '4 lobes to their brains', two of which were biological and two which were basically circuit-boards and chips, and it becomes very obvious that some really extraordinary stuff is going on with regard to the mastery of both physical genetics and consciousness.


My kick with 'nasty Dracos' is that 1) Reptile=Evil is a distinctly human meme, and 2) stuff can indeed be staged via Photoshop or whatever. If inconvenient things can be airbrushed/excised from photos (routine, according to Disclosure witnesses), then the inverse can also be true-- stuff can be concocted, and probably has been.

Also, many Disclosure witnesses have talked about the cloning of 'creepy creatures', specifically designed to be particularly psychologically repulsive *to humans*. I see no reason to doubt these witnesses, as their stories are unwittingly corroborated by other Disclosure witnesses who have come forward to testify about other issues.

I had the pleasure of personally hearing and speaking with Dr. Carol Rosin at one of the Disclosure events a few years back, and she repeatedly says that Von Braun was really scared about the weaponization of space. The main reason he told her about the bogus enemies (Russia, Rogue Nations, Asteroids, and Evil Aliens, in that order) is that he wanted to impress on her that all of these were false foes from the get-go, and that they were being used as excuses by trigger-happy ignoramuses to put weapons into space for two reasons-- 1) to cow everybody on Earth into submission to 'the few', and 2) to actively target the Skypeople. Several other Disclosure witnesses have said that about half the clandestine stuff that's already up there is not pointed at the Earth, but out towards deep space, and that we have indeed shot down a few of their craft, yet they are quite forebearant and do not retaliate.

So, if there was such a thing as 'arrogant, human-hating Dracos' who make humans 'bow before them' (a particularly human way to display servility) and who 'do not allow humans to make eye-contact with them' (again, a standard human dominance ritual, routinely used in U.S. military basic training by DIs and in U.S. prisons by guards on inmates), we would have already been soundly thrashed for even daring to point *one* killer satellite in their direction, let alone 50 or so...



marsandro said...

Hi T'Zairis,

Hmmm...I see now.

So, I presume you must be familiar with things like

I had wondered what was going on with that. Now
it makes sense (or, perhaps a bit more accurately,
more sense than it did).

So...our Draco buddies are nothing but oversized
lab lizards....

And "SOHO Theatre" is a psyop....

No wonder Shuttle astronauts have taken to booze....


Hathor -- One eyebrow raised in "ah - HA" mode...


P.S.: Considering where classified military genetic
science was thirty years ago, the creation of a
"Draco" from a Kimodo Dragon would be a simple

Vestigial tail, walk upright, raise the IQ to
around 250 or so....

Voila! Instant Draco.

Just like making Fizzies.... :-))))


P.P.S: One must always remember that classified
technologies are far ahead of what is generally

Case in point: can you name the first operational
turbofan jet aircraft?

Notice I did *NOT* say "fighter"....

If you guessed "the ME-262"'re WRONG!

It was the Petroni Jet, which flew in 1929. (Even
the P-1101 and the He-280 preceded the ME-262,
which had Jumo 004 engines with high-speed
balance problems.)

The Petroni Jet is commonly known today as the
now-obsolete Lockheed T-33.

Non-inline turbofan jet engines existed prior to
1920, believe it or not. And that wasn't the
classified stuff. Those were the publicly known

(Application of these engines to aviation had some
issues needing to be resolved, hence you did not
see a lot of jets in WW II.)

Such examples abound....


marsandro said...

Hi Valkyrie,

You make a good, strong case, difficult to refute.

It certainly clarifies things here and there.

Albeit, could there not be the occaisional alien
race that is...shall we say, "tolerated" by the others?

Your position would seem to suggest a level of
unity for which I am not sure we have a great deal
of direct evidence.

Then again, the suggested "good cop/bad cop"
scenario certainly would make it hard to determine
such a thing.

You can't analyze the top of the totem pole
when you're the low man.... :-))

But you can feel the weight of those above.... :-))


Hathor -- Reviewing Philosophy...


T'Zairis said...


Yes, I am familiar with the pix that John Lenard Walson has taken, and I am also familiar with the SOHO stuff as well as the cylinders near Saturn. I think they all show legit 'somethings', but it is the interpretation of those 'somethings' that I think needs sorting out. It's a good idea not to look at these things through a strictly Earth-human-interpretation lens, but I think that some of the conclusions being foisted on folks are attempts to limit thinking to the 'human-lens' possibility only.

For instance-- there have been sightings of smaller craft/lights flying straight at larger objects/ships at a very high rate of speed. They do not slow down at all, and they look for all the world like they are going to crash into the large object. There is a huge, sudden flash of light, and then the smaller object is gone. So what happened?

The Earth-military mindset explanation would be, 'The smaller ship was attacking the bigger ship, and the bigger ship blew it away with some exotic weapon or force-field. It's war out there in the stars!'

The exotic physics explanation would be, 'The larger ship is in phase with this dimension-- we see it clearly. The small lights coming in are out-of-phase ships stepping down from trans-light or alternate dimensional states. As they match frequency with the larger ship, they fully materialize, emitting a burst of light, and then they dock with or enter the larger ship.'

The exotic physics explanation is exactly what happened at Bentwaters, when the basketball-sized glowing sphere suddenly 'exploded' in a soundless, shock-waveless burst of light and morphed into a tetrahedron/triangular-shaped craft that looked like it was made out of obsidian or black onyx. What was witnessed there was a dimensional step-down in action, pure and simple.

Now, both Disclosure witnesses and the Bentwater witnesses (some of whom are also Disclosure witnesses) keep repeating the same 'they don't attack us, but they do pointedly warn us that we will not be allowed to use nukes' story. The military-control-freak mindset chooses to feel under attack when thus warned because its dominant paradigm and in-culture status are threatened by beings who are many tens of times more technologically capable than they themselves are. However, as a shamanically-oriented human who does not seek to control her fellow beings, I choose to look at these Skyperson reminders as basic common sense, proffered by those who are more expert in things like dimensional rips than I currently am. I am no more threatened by the Skypeople knowing more than me than I was by my Dad knowing calculus when I was struggling with my times-tables in third grade. I mean, big fat hairy deal!

So what I try to do is just collect everything-- all the data I can. Then I lay it out and look for trends; what supports or contradicts other bits, what is self-consistent and what internally contradicts itself from the get-go. When I see everyone except for Military/Intel-connected types saying 'they mean us no harm', I think I have correctly spotted a genuine trend in the data.

I would say, don't throw out the SOHO-baby with the bathwater, but don't focus strictly on the pix themselves. Also focus on what is being said about them, and on *who* is saying *what*.



Valkyrie Ice said...

Unity is not required. Any civilization no matter how advanced will not share a single mode of thought.

So I am quite sure various factions exist, some which are more wary of us than others and so on.

However, a civilization that spans stars has enough resources to reduce a single planet to a burning ball of rock with no means for us to defend ourselves. We are no threat to them as we are. At best some may fear what we could become and work to keep the worst from happening, not for their sake, because regardless we are no threat to them, but for the sake of humanity itself.

and there may be factions that are simply "let em kill themselves"

Until we get disclosure we're not going to know the truth. Perhaps the Draco's are military "fakes" perhaps they are a real and dangerous species. Regardless, they are a little too convenient for a military obsessed with Alpha Male Dominance behavior.

It's that genetic legacy which has cursed man from the beginning, that DNA driven need to be top dog of top dogs. It's the root cause of almost all human suffering. Knowing that, it makes it far too likely that faced with an OVERWHELMING alpha dog of alpha dogs those who are top dog on earth would seek to do everything they could to STAY top dog, even if it's just top dog of one planet. The Draco's are all too convenient both as a "threat" and a "cover" behind which the alpha dog elite can hide.

Still, it does seem likely that we'll find out for sure within a decade or two. Either by Disclosure, or picking away at the wall of secrecy until nothing is left hidden.

For example, now that other countries are going to the moon, NASA can't hide things much longer. Even though I would bet that their "bomb the moon to look for water" is a cover for destroying something they don't want found, they would only be doing so because they know that they are losing control of their monopoly on space. Hopefully whatever they are trying to destroy either defends itself or the "bomb" get's deactivated before something of vast historical value get's trashed.

marsandro said...

Hi T'Zairis,

Point taken.


In the case of one particular SOHO sequence I've
seen, the "battle interpretation" would seem to
be unequivocal. It went like this.

1. Draco warship (?) approaches two cylinder ships

2. Cylinder ships maneuver to high flanks.

3. Draco warship (?) fires something (?) at the
cylinder ships.

4. The cylinder ships return fire.

5. There is an explosion at the "bridge" portion of
the Draco warship (?).

6. The Draco warship (?) explodes, leaving only a
glowing debris field.

7. The cylinder ships fly on.

It's a bit difficult to interpret such a sequence
as much of anything but warfare of some kind.

Or so it seems to viewpoint....


I'm one puzzled pussycat....

< o\|/
(= o-)
< o/|\


Hathor -- Leaving the door open to Mr. Churchill....


P.S.: Then there was that "ship of the gods" (the
one that looks like an Egyptian heiroglyph) "firing"
a beam surrounded by plasma rings the size of something beyond view....

I mean, what in THE WORLD....

Communications? Beaming over to another ship?

Or a weapon???

If nothing else, an astounding amount of POWER
evident, as compared to the size of the ship,
which in any event, reportedly is on the scale
of the Greenland object.

And sporting a "crucifix" on top to boot....

Complete with a..."Christ figure"....

And yet, even *that* is "puny" compared to the...
planet-building machine???

Let's face it...we don't have a clue, do we....

I sure don't....


marsandro said...

Hi Val,

Hmmm...yes, you do make a good point.

However, I would say that there are many other
perceived "alien threats" besides the "dreaded
Draco," David Icke and company notwithstanding.

And then, there are the "elementals" of the late
John A. Keel, which could be something else

To quote the Wicked Witch of the West,

"Oh, what a world, what a world...."


Hathor -- Reading "Our Haunted Planet"...


marsandro said...

Oh Val,

One other thing---

It is indeed odd that NASA would "bomb the Moon
to look for water," since elsewhere on their own
websites, they list what they know about the
Moon, to wit, that it's a giant *hollow* titanium
sphere with an artificial regolith averaging only
about 16 feet deep across the entire surface.

Knowing that, why would they "bomb for water?"

Why, indeed?

Good point....

VERY good point....


Hathor -- Standing shoulder to shoulder with Val
and The Tigress


T'Zairis said...


Another possibility I will throw out there with regard to seemingly-fighting ships is war-gaming. Presumably they have to practice with their technology just like we do with ours, and I am sure they probably do live-fire training for most of the same reasons our military does.

Keel is an interesting read. I have always thought that those tall, blonde Celtic fairies were probably Skypeople, who I think share the planet with us (via underground settlements) along with being spacefaring.

Likewise, all those lights that gave Silbury Hill over in England its nicknames of 'Golden Ball Hill' and 'Hill of the Shining Beings' were/are very likely more advanced technology that was classified as 'magic' or 'supernatural', as early humans had no context to place it in.

My own experience 'doing the shaman-thing' has shown me that the Astral Plane/Higher dimensions/Dreamscape is a continuum-- Spirit-beings (elementals, angels, Spirit-guides, etc.), deceased humans (ancestral spirits) and advanced-tech peoples (Skypeople) are all in evidence there. This is also in line with accounts by other experiencers, like Lisette Larkins and some of the Disclosure witnesses.

The thing that most people do not understand is that everyone's imagination is not 'just their imagination'. It is in-folded higher dimensionality and is the 'Cosmic USB-port' that consciousness-based tech plugs into.



Valkyrie Ice said...

If the "draco" are a fabricated "warrior" race made by earth based groups using reverse engineered weapons, I could easily see a draco ship being swatted by an advanced race being attacked by it.

Based on your own stories here, the Draco are definitely on the losing end of most of these "battles" with their ships utterly destroyed vs. moderate damage.

Simply put, there is no possible way a war could last 80,000 years in a civilization capable of superluminal travel. And war between civilizations without superluminal travel is utterly impossible.

Any war between superluminal civs would last as long as any typical war elsewhere. If you are at all familiar with the concept of nanotechnology you should be able to grasp the idea that a nanotech civilization can manufacture warships the way we manufacture computer chips. And they could afford to build millions of ships. any smaller civilization, no matter how warlike, could never hope to defeat the overwhelming force such a civ could bring to bear.

It's like Afghanistan. America could devote enough resources to create a line of troops completely around their borders and do a full carpet saturation from the borders into the center, leaving nothing alive behind them. If it was a choice between the utter destruction of Afghanistan or eternal war, we would do it. It would cost fewer lives in the long run. Any highly advanced civilization would be in a similar position against a single planet or smaller civ.

By this logic, the draco's are therefore either a manufactured "threat" occasionally sacrificed as a "test" of whether the alpha dog militarists can effectively battle against the "invaders" or to provide "evidence" of the "invaders" hostility...

Or they are involved in a cold war of the sort engaged in for decades by America and the USSR, with the typical "border incidents". Considering the instability of such a scenario, this seems less likely, as such a cold war would either eventually lead to full war, or would eventually lead to the stagnation and collapse of one of the two cultures.

Essentially, I cannot buy into the idea that ANY culture could stagnate to the point that it would cease to advance for thousands of years without collapsing at some point during that time. Evolution simply does not allow it to occur. The same goes for a "cold war" sooner or later one civ would develop a tech which they would feel gives them an unbeatable advantage and full war would commence.

I don't make any claims to be a military specialist, but I have studied cultural and technological development due to my interests in Atlantis and science in general, and studied the rise and fall of civilizations. A thousand years ago, Islam was the highest, most sophisticated culture in the world, until the rigid ideology of the islamic theocracy set in, much as the Christian theocracy destroyed the previous Roman civilization. But while such theocracies stifled innovation and stagnated cultures for centuries, technological innovation will always gradually erode the hold such ideologies hold, so 80,000 years of unchangingness is just improbable.

I suppose with "the lie is different at every level" finding the truth is going to be a long process of eliminating blind ends.

As for the moon, can you provide a link to that site about the hollow moon? I have heard this theory before, and would be extremely interested in more information. considering the "bomb" is supposed to make a "five mile deep" hole according to one article I read, I wonder what they think is there that needs to be destroyed so badly. If it is an alien base, that bomb is never going to reach the surface. If it is a historical artifact, I can only hope that something intervenes to keep NASA from destroying valuable historical data.

And if it does hit, the question is if it is designed to pierce the surface and explode inside the moon? Would NASA nuke the moon?

I wonder if this is going to be the straw that breaks NASA's back?

marsandro said...

Hi T'Zairis,

If these are war games, I'm certainly impressed by
the expendable hardware...I mean, geez, these
guys have a budget to make Obama blush.

Good point, though. No doubt practice makes
perfect, even for Skypeople.

As for "Nordic" fairies, it would seem to beg the
question, "When is an alien not an alien?"

More to the point, and a good one, what should
we call "supernatural," as opposed to high tech?
And where to draw the line?

As to Disclosure, I'll have to read up on it to be
able to comment more incisively....

Your point about "the USB line to imagination"
is an excellent one. No doubt you would enjoy
reading the account of King Gillette's vision of the
first injector razor. "It was more as if the finished
product was held before my eyes...."

I first read the account in a book entitled (if I can
recall correctly), "Introduction to Engineering,"
used in Engineering Science 105 at Texas A&M in
the early 1970s.

The account might be on the web....

The book touched on this very subject, that is, on
the nature of imagination and the origin of ideas.


Hathor -- Enjoying the discourse...


marsandro said...

Hi Val,

Our lovely Govt and the "Draco" allegedly are in
league with one another. There have been a
number of eyewitness accounts of these Reptoids
being in high-security positions at highly classified
military installations.

Preston Nichols (I think was his name) allegedly
was one of the Montauk engineers, and attested
to the presence of these creatures....

Oh, and I did not mean to suggest that a war with
the Draco (?) had *lasted* 80,000 years. That was
merely the time since what I call "The Nephilim War(s)"....

As to *one* party of a war not having hyperspeed
transport, there *can* be a war between two such
parties if *one* of them can reach the other.

But then, your previous points would apply...why
would such a war take place....

I just wouldn't quite go so far as to deem it to be
"impossible"...that's *my* opinion, at least....

Granted, "bear fights bear" is a lot more likely, or
dare I say "reasonable," than "bear fights mouse."
I'm with you there....

For our purposes, however, that just means that
"the mystery deepens"....

Right on about nanotech. I am an engineer, and
have had occaision to comment on it at some length
in this forum. I also know Eric Drexler personally,
having met him in 1978 at the home of Keith and
Carolyn Henson, founders of the L5 Society. He
was still a grad student at U of A Tucson then,
just doing his Master's thesis on the idea of

Anyway, the "Draco" supposedly have been on
Earth from the time of Lemuria, having lived
peacably alongside the Lyrans (i.e., the Atlanteans)
for many centuries, until war broke out over (as
some claim) control of the Earth.

Population issues, maybe...or maybe just plain old
"irreconcilable differences"....

(Comically, I picture some Draco father telling
his daughter, "You are *NOT* marrying that---
that---that LYRAN....")

As usual, you make good points....


Hathor -- Seeing the humor EVEN in this...


marsandro said...

Addendum to Val,

I'm looking for the page in
question with the lunar info.

I'll let you know when I come across it again.

It's not the "basic information" page, but it's
another one buried on their site somewhere.

I forget how I came across it....

Hmmm...maybe something I found at the Mars
Anomaly website or somewhere...a NASA link
they gave in a link list....


Hathor -- Playing internet detective...


T'Zairis said...


I like the Gillette story! It's yet more evidence that our current models of Mind are rather inaccurate.

One thing that a lot of experiencers talk about is the difficulty of hard-and-fast classifications of exactly what beings encountered 'on the Astral' actually are. There is also mounting evidence that the (Earth-mythological) Fae-folk and Skypeople may be the same thing, as might (human-concept) angels and the Greys' 'disembodied energy-Being' teachers. John Mack was running into this a lot when he was studying the experiencer phenomenon, and you also get this same conflation when you start studying the accounts of entheogen-users, a la Terrence McKenna and his DMT-vision 'machine elves' and 'self-dribbling jeweled basketballs'. It's what Arthur C. Clarke was talking about when he made that 'advanced civilizations' technologies being indistinguishable from magic' remark.

I think that one of the main reasons for the genetic tweaking of humanity is that our neural nets are being upgraded so as to be able to begin to decode/experience higher dimensional realms. I also think that entheogens are part of the bioengineering program, and that what is 'seen' is actually infolded higher dimensionality. Since most of Western science-based reality-formatting has dropped shamanic models of consciousness, it terms these visions 'simple biological hallucinations', because it does not have any other coherent model for what is really being experienced by a Huichol shaman during a peyote trance.

Researchers also get tripped up when they try to classify inner/upper dimensional Beings as if they must fit neatly into only one pigeon-hole. I strongly suspect that the truth is that advanced consciousness-technology-wielding Skypeople can also be angels and faeries all at the same time.

A case in point is the apparition of the 'Virgin Mary' at Fatima. Portuguese researchers have found that early accounts of what the children said described the Being who appeared to them as only about three-and-one-half feet tall, and that--unlike humans-- she had solid black eyes. She never identified herself to the children as the Virgin Mary, nor did any of the children ever refer to her as such. When a standard-issue statute of the Virgin Mary was erected by the Catholic Church at the site, the oldest of the three children was asked 'Is this the lady that you saw?' to which she responded, 'This lady (meaning the statue) is very beautiful, but she is not the lady that we saw.'

The bottom line is, if we really want to get a handle on what is going on, we need to get out of the this-or-that, 'it can only be one thing at a time' paradigm. It's time for a reality-formatting-code upgrade...



marsandro said...

Hi T'Zairis,

I thought you'd appreciate that
particular story.

I've had a number of quite similar experiences.

How we perceive reality indeed is an issue ripe
for discussion. Consider:

Most people start grinning that funny grin when
one speaks of "beings of light."

And yet, what are *we*?

Let's change viewpoint---

Wait for dark, put on a pair of infrared goggles,
and look at the passing people. What do you see?

How about...

"Beings Of Light"....

We glow in the infrared. It's as simple as that.

And what is physical reality?

Start at the quantum vacuum, proceed from there
to Bergman particle theory, and consider that all
particle interactions are energy transfers via what
we call "fields" (that term being borrowed from

It's all in how we think of it.

Ah! The key!


Perception, where it lives.

Well said, T'Zairis!


Hathor -- Probing the Mystery of Reality


P.S.: Am I starting to write like Charles Fort,
or what?


P.P.S: Some people say, "Oh, it's all in your head!"

Why, that's exactly right!



Valkyrie Ice said...

My view has always been that we are born able to see almost everything, but as we are wired to imitate, as we grow older we begin to filter out those things which our elders cannot see, basically creating mental filters based on what we observe as being "real" in the sense that they are visible to everyone.

As a evolutionary strategy this makes some sense as we want to be able to see the leopard sneaking up on us instead of being distracted by the immaterial. Yet we never lose the ability to see everything. Some people can consciously put aside these filters and re-enable full sight, others do not do as well.

I've never "seen" anything, but I have been able to sense the occasional unusual "energy" and have some theories about how "magic" might work. Alas I cannot at present do anything like OBE or stuff like that. I cannot enter a trance state and I have been impossible to hypnotize when it's been tried. Even such things as THC, Ecstasy, and LSD seem to have muted or negligible effects on me.

However, I am quite looking forward to the advent of full immersion VR. It should make a wonderful teaching tool for meditations and consciousness evolution.

marsandro said...

Hi Val,

( *gulp* ) I cringed
when I read that list

To each their own....

Be that as it may, our perceptions obviously are
not limited to the so-called "five senses."

If they were, "remote viewing" would not exist.

Perception exercizes involving dealing with mental
imagery might interest you. What T'Zairis and I
have been discussing is the origin of those very
mental images.

You don't have to try to "make them come from
somewhere." They already do. Just learn to
concentrate on the ones that are of interest,
and "follow the yellow brick road" wherever it
leads you.

That's the trick I think you are seeking.

My two cents, anyway....


Hathor -- Trying to be helpful...


Valkyrie Ice said...

What can I say. 20 years ago I was young and willing to do somewhat stupid things. The ex was the last thing I tried and it had no effect at all. LSD made me jittery but other wise had no effect. THC give me a small buzz, and thats about all. It's like drinking a couple of glasses of wine.

Most manufactured drugs have minimal effects on me as well. don't know why. cold meds make me feel worse, alcohol give me an allergic reaction, and most pain killers other than pure morphine or vicodin are completely useless. My body is very drug resistant.

I do have one very strong reoccurring vision, an image that continuously recreates itself fairly regularly in my day dreams and sleeping dreams. If you're interested in it, check out my blog, since it's detailed in full there. It's one that I've been having since I was a child and I still don't have any idea what it means. But it's the reason why I go by the name Valkyrie and the reason for my little Avatar over there.

marsandro said...


I wonder if NASA is cringing
over that list of chemicals
the Indians mentioned with
regard to the Moon?

(Namely, di-hydrogen oxide....)


Hathor -- Unable to resist that one...


T'Zairis said...

Here is the little news-blurb from the Earthfiles website...

October 18, 2009 - NASA Says LCROSS Moon Impact
Experiment A Success, But No Water Ice Data Released.

“To be a spectacular success, we had to find large quantities
of underground ice. Ice on the moon is more valuable than gold.”
- Michio Kaku, Ph.D., Quantum Physicist, City College of New York

The NASA crash of its Lunar CRater Observation
and Sensing Satellite (LCROSS) on October 9, 2009, was to see if water ice
would fly into the air when the LCROSS impacted the Cabeus crater
(white dot in Cabeus crater at moon's south pole above). “We are blown away
by the data returned,” said Anthony Colaprete, LCROSS principal investigator
and project scientist. But so far, no announcement about what was found in the
$79 million experiment.

I have never wanted to b*tch-slap a bunch of people this bad in my entire life!

Also, this really does prove Max's point about what they were really trying to find when they bombed Cabeus. If it was water they were looking for, and that's what was found, there is no reason for not immediately releasing all the experiment data. Period.


marsandro said...

Oh T'Zairis,

I bust up *SO* hard whenever I
read these posts from you!

I LOVE IT!!!!!!!

I mean, look who is cited---none other than
Michio Kaku, the very chief priest of those who
live in denial of new observations.

Talk about the Head Gatekeeper....

Or maybe, "Defender of the Faith"...

...a la Dr. Zaius....

I'd like nothing more than to go head-to-head
against him on Coast To Coast AM and tear him
a new one!

And I'd want you there with me! You AND Val!


Hathor -- Let's b*tch-slap 'em TOGETHER!


P.S.: Yo, Max---

SCORE!!!!!!!! TWO POINTS!!!!!!!!

YOU da man!!!!!!!!


T'Zairis said...


Michio has bothered me for ages! He's touted as this hot-shot futurist physics expert, and yet he natters on about NASA-style (a.k.a. primitive) hardware when it comes to future space travel technology.

When the Captain's Blog was up and running, I remember mentioning a paper that was posted on the Los Alamos website about anti-gravity technology. If Los Alamos takes anti-grav tech seriously, why doesn't Kaku? (I also refuse to believe that as a 'physicist of good professional standing' he would be ignorant of the Los Alamos website and its contents, especially when I was able to find the paper on the website in about 3 minutes, and *I'm not even in the field*!)

He also seemingly 'came out of nowhere' to be the latest gatekeeper talking head-- one minute, no one's ever heard of him, and the next he's all over the media being roundly praised as an eminent futurist, etc.-- so I think we are looking at the latest Sagan-clone...



marsandro said...

Right on, T'Zairis!

I was just about to say:

"It would seem that Michio Kaku is the heir
apparent to the late Carl Sagan."

Now all we need to do is go place some copies of
"Dark Mission" in front of one of Kaku's books at
Barnes & Noble....

( on back, kicking, laughing hysterically...)


Hathor -- Getting ready for Barnes & Noble


P.S.: Mike! You're a trend-setter!


Valkyrie Ice said...

Considering Kaku is the chief proponent of Superstrings, Hyperspace and so on, one would think he would be a bit more openminded, especially regarding the future.

But I've known he was anything but a futurist when he once said nanotech was "impossible" despite the fact that biology is nothing more than proof of concept of nanotech.

He's the Anti-Kurzweil. He's just a good looking talking head for anti-progress.

Valkyrie Ice said...

Very interesting article here on private ground to orbit launch capable rockets.

According to the article they will take over supplying the ISS during the interim between the shuttle retirement and Orion.


Space is no longer even NASA's exclusive in the USA.

How long before private groups who are NOT under NASA's thumb start providing interesting data?

How long before private Moon probes might be heading out?

Disclosure may be coming sooner than I thought.

Should be interesting.

T'Zairis said...

"He's the Anti-Kurzweil. He's just a good looking talking head for anti-progress."

I'm with you on this, Val! I remember him being plugged as the latest scientific flavor-of-the-month with regard to the future of space travel, and in the interview I was reading, he just droned on and on about ion-drive propulsion. The first questions that popped into my head were, 'Well what about the Biefield-Brown effect?' and 'Well, what about that anti-grav propulsion paper on the Los Alamos website?'

As I continued to read through the interview, it became clear that he was there to steer thinking into appropriate and accepted channels, rather than to do any speculation and/or extrapolation, as one would expect a 'futurist' to indulge in. He also spends a lot of time addressing what *can't* be done or *can't possibly be made to work*, which has always seemed a very funny stance for a futurist to take.

I've become so fed up with his lack of imagination and apparent inability to address any 'outside the box' theories, that I now actively avoid his interviews and articles, because all it usually consists of is a rehash of the status quo.



Valkyrie Ice said...

Check out the "Future 2057" series he did for Discovery channel.

They are absolute horror stories disguised as futurism, with the barest minimum of possible new tech.

I mean, RETINA SCANS in 2057??? Insurance companies invading your home with drug scanners in your toilet? A world still using oil 50 years from now?

Everything Kaku has been in is as anti progress as it's possible to be. He talks about progress, but never in any way that would actually be called PROGRESS. For a show about 50 years hence, nothing was more than maybe 10-15 years from development.

Starborne said...

You know, I watched that 2057 series that Kaku put together. I was expecting alot more... but of course I was let down. When these little "future" programs aired in the 1950's, they were alot more hopeful, and showed many more inovations that were and still are possible, but of course are not available to us.

It all boils down to "How will we continue to be in power over them if we relase this research?" It's hard to keep a large population under enslavement when they are using the same gadgets as you. It's also easy to keep the backyard scientists from thinking outside the box when they are repeatedly told what "won't work".

It really is disgusting to see the "creativity blocking" agendas that the mainstream keeps on pumping out to keep us all in the dark and afraid to step out of line and start asking the tough questions.

What is nice to see is that these arguments and propaganda that are designed to perpetuate this farce of a human civilization, are becoming more and more transparent every day. The more people start questioning the establishments, and poking around where we "don't belong", the faster the rest of us are starting to see it for what it really is.

The veil is finally starting to lift here, and air is now becoming more clear. "Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain!"

Oh how silly it all seems now!

Valkyrie Ice said...

Their big mistake was making the internet.

It's hard to keep the lies going when people can simply hop online and find people willing to refute the lies. And since the internet treats censorship and repression as damage to route around, as soon as they try to hide a leak, it springs up in a hundred new places. Even disinformation isn't enough as people begin collating the various lies, seeing where they don't match up, and work their way down to the truth.

for all the junk data on the web, there is also a filtering process that is ongoing. Millions of people are sorting that data, tagging it, distributing it, and mining it, and what is happening is that the REAL data is slowly but surely being filtered out of the Junk.

Give it five more years and I bet we'll start seeing some truly amazing information becoming publicly available. Already you can see it starting to affect American politics. The People are making their collective will known, and the small groups who've been trying desperately to keep their grip on the reins of power are finding them slipping. As the net reaches into more nations and to more people across the globe, it's going to destroy the entire basis of power for these groups, their secrecy.

A NWO is coming, but it's not the one conspiracy theorists think is coming. It's a One World united by it's electronic nervous system and ruled by it's collective intelligence, not one ruled by a small elite.

marsandro said...

Well said, Val.

Even so, to be thorough,
I'd have to say---

It's a matter of who gets in first.

I'm reminded of that episode of Star Trek where
Kirk was battling the Gorn, and Spock kept saying,
"IF he has the time, Doctor...IF he has the time."

It's going to be a race....

Control nodes are going in all over the web
even as we speak....

And GeoCities, the birthplace of the blog, just
had the plug pulled last night.


Hathor -- Watching the covert action as well...


P.S.: Something good to know---


1. pass
2. palm
3. ditch
4. drop
5. pickup
6. misdirection
7. simulation

With Thanks to Penn & Teller.


Valkyrie Ice said...

They can put in all the control nodes they want. They will still be hacked around. It's a hundred million hackers to however many thousands of controllers. The numbers against are too overwhelming. Look at how useless DRM has been.

The Net does not abide control. It hasn't since day one, and it's not going to change just because some people think they can put limits on it. It's very nature as an unbreakable network works against control.

They might be able to block off a section temporarily, but that is all.

I've watched this back and forth for 30 years now.

T'Zairis said...

The mining/sorting of info is why there is that whole 'curtail/censor the Internet' nonsense going on in U.S. 'gubmint' circles, and the push to censor private party file-sharing (which affects record-company moguls' pocketbooks way more than the artists') is what has helped give birth to the Pirate Party, which is gaining political traction in Europe. Issues of copyright (and illegal extension of the copyright concept done via the legal-language trick called 'intellectual property'), invasion of privacy and internet censorship are vitally important issues, and so-called 'ordinary' people do in fact understand this.

Figures also show that in the U.S., standard media viewership/readership is steadily dwindling, and it is to the internet that people are turning for news. Libraries are also going digital, because it solves the 'we don't have the space to store back issues of all these journals' problem, and it also makes Inter-Library Loans (ILLs) of certain materials darned near instantaneous. This means that people can get heretofore 'obscure' stuff a whole lot easier-- it gets scanned at the owning library, and they send it electronically to your library, who then turns around and emails it to you for a usually-modest fee, and presto-- you have instant access to what used to be flat-out un-loan-able.

I will also mention that if one does a few quick source-checks to see exactly who is saying that the internet is an 'untrustworthy source of news', one will find that it is mainstream-media/government/intel types who are flogging this idea. These are the very same people who want to control the internet, but who are way beyond 'a day late and a dollar short' when it comes to stemming the flow of info.

This flow of info influences many disparate things, too-- for example, it becomes very hard for the Roman Catholic hierarchy to pitch Opus Dei as morally upright and theologically important when there are Opus Dei abuse-recovery-group websites out there, being manned by observant Catholics who have quite a story to tell.

Personally, I have long since ceased to watch any TV (it's four years and counting for me), and especially TV news, as they do not even begin to cover any of the issues I am vitally interested in. I do not need some fluff-communications-major himbo/bimbo talking-head telling me about the latest 'health-news' when I can pull up everything from the Mayo Clinic medical-condition-reference page to prescription drug/herbal supplement interactions (courtesy of MedWeb) online. The sad fact is, the standard news media goes nowhere near the topics of NASA shenanigans, crop circles, plasma cosmology, over-unity physics, alternative medicine, and many other things I have a personal interest in, so by and large, TV has become completely irrelevant to me and how I live my life. The figures show it's that way for increasing numbers of people, to which I can only say, 'GOOD!!!'



marsandro said...

"Duh, what's a TV?"

I'm with ya, T'Zairis.

I've been away from it for over eight years now,
and I must say, when I see it at Mickie D's, it
just looks plain ridiculous somehow.

And right on yet again, Val,

not to mention there's a resurgence in the BBS
phenomenon, or so I hear.

Well, well, well. I almost can't wait for
Marshall Law, to see how it all works out.

Should be interesting!


Hathor -- Checking the supplies